What would you be willing to give up?

[Dghs48]

A typical progressive death plan. Whether you speak slowly or not. I understand you very well.

[Pragmaticone]

What, if any, would be the fine for not having such a sticker?

Large enough to raise significant revenue for each violation. And the cost of the sticker would have be set low enough to be viewed as good value insurance against being fined for using the city streets without paying your fair share for the privilege.

[Jack of Hearts]

A typical progressive death plan. Whether you speak slowly or not. I understand you very well.

Death to the Debt - I like that.

What, if any, would be the fine for not having such a sticker?

Large enough to raise significant revenue for each violation. And the cost of the sticker would have be set low enough to be viewed as good value insurance against being fined for using the city streets without paying your fair share for the privilege.

That's what I thought you'd say. People should pay "for the privilege" of using public streets - pay for what it already theirs. Or do you think the govt should own the streets and not the people? (Stay in your hovels or pay. )
When you get around to taxing the sidewalks, will three legged dogs get a handicap discount?

[Pragmaticone]

People should pay "for the privilege" of using public streets - pay for what it already theirs.
Public city streets do not belong to the people...they are owned by the city. And somebody has to pay to maintain them. Who more logical to do that than the users?
Or do you think the govt should own the streets and not the people?
Yes.
(Stay in your hovels or pay. )
Agreed.
When you get around to taxing the sidewalks, will three legged dogs get a handicap discount?
No discounts to any user.

[Jack of Hearts]

- from Taxman (Harrison)
(if you drive a car;) - I'll tax the street;
(if you try to sit;) - I'll tax your seat;
(if you get too cold;) - I'll tax the heat;
(if you take a walk;) - I'll tax your feet.

Harrison had a nightmare, to Prag it was a dream.

[Pragmaticone]

Harrison had a nightmare, to Prag it was a dream.

Taxes are not a dream, they are a harsh reality. No government can function without them. My only gripe with our federal income tax system is that it is fundamentally unfair in not taxing everyone the same percentage of their income. Most of our city governments are funded with a sales tax where everyone who purchases goods within the city pay the same percentage...a fair tax.

[Jack of Hearts]

Harrison had a nightmare, to Prag it was a dream.

Taxes are not a dream, they are a harsh reality. No government can function without them. My only gripe with our federal income tax system is that it is fundamentally unfair in not taxing everyone the same percentage of their income. Most of our city governments are funded with a sales tax where everyone who purchases goods within the city pay the same percentage...a fair tax.

Your calling such a "fair tax" does not make it so - it's unfair, and regressive. That many states and local govts don't tax the basic necessities like food and drugs with a sales tax proves my point. That some govts give income tax credit for sales tax spent again is a concession to equalizing it's inherent unfairness.
Go ahead and call your most freedom-robbing legislation "The Patriot Act", and call your regressive and draconian tax program a "Fair Tax" - but you aren't fooling anybody with your self-interest soundbites.

[Dghs48]

If everyone has a "right" to a job, then everyone has a responsibility to pay a portion of the load....i.e income taxes.

[Jack of Hearts]

Having a "right to a job" is a nice soundbite. Still, your sentence really doesn't make sense.
It's a cornerstone of communism, but I don't see how it's applicable here in America.
I agree everybody has a responsibility to support society. But to whom much is given, much is expected.
We don't pay the same amount; we don't pay the same proportion; we pay to the best of our ability.
In America, we get paid according to our ability to perform, and we get taxed according our ability to pay.

[Pragmaticone]

In America, we get paid according to our ability to perform,
That is as it should be.
and we get taxed according our ability to pay.
That is unfair. It simply makes no logical sense to reward the lesser achievers by assessing them with a lower tax rate than those who have worked harder and smarter and achieved more.

Let's drop the time consuming obsession with enacting deficit/debt growing ObamaCare and use that energy to reform the inequitable IRS tax laws.

[Dghs48]

Jack: Let's hope we rid ourselves of the current4 President before he "spreads it around "any more.

[Jack of Hearts]

In America, we get paid according to our ability to perform,
That is as it should be.
and we get taxed according our ability to pay.
That is unfair. It simply makes no logical sense to reward the lesser achievers by assessing them with a lower tax rate than those who have worked harder and smarter and achieved more.

Let's drop the time consuming obsession with enacting deficit/debt growing ObamaCare and use that energy to reform the inequitable IRS tax laws.

Taxing the poor and marginalized is beyond unfair - it's stupid! It's like trying to get blood from a stone.
If you don't tax those who can pay - where is the money going to come from? - DUH!
And please stop resurrecting that debased "achievers" argument, it's already beyond LAME!
Rich coupon-clipping bondholders do not work harder than the higher tax-rated construction workers. They do not achieve more than those who physically build and maintain America's infrastructure. And if they be smarter, it is by luck of the draw, not by any self 'achievement.'
You do not speak at all toward fairness, you speak to greed.

Obamacare is needed and is wanted by most Americans. Your, "I got mine - screw you." attitude shall not prevail.

[Pragmaticone]

If you don't tax those who can pay - where is the money going to come from? - DUH!
True, more dollars flow to the Treasury from those with higher incomes. By what logic do you conclude that it is stupid to tax citizens who provide less tax revenue than other, more affluent citizens do?
And please stop resurrecting that debased "achievers" argument, it's already beyond LAME!
Rich coupon-clipping bondholders do not work harder than the higher tax-rated construction workers. They do not achieve more than those who physically build and maintain America's infrastructure. And if they be smarter, it is by luck of the draw, not by any self 'achievement.'
If you don't want to admit that achievement among our citizens varies significantly I can only suggest you consult Google for income and wealth statistics.
You do not speak at all toward fairness, you speak to greed.
No, I speak to fairness in taxation. That you imagine fairness is greed is your problem, not mine.
Obamacare is needed and is wanted by most Americans.
ObamaCare? Is that where the government forces the insurance companies to provide more coverage but the premiums go down? The government program that costs a trillion dollars but reduces the deficit? The ObamaCare that forces insurance companies to keep adult offspring on the parents policy until the "kids" are 26? You definitely need a course in ObamaMath if you are buying that snake oil.
Your, "I got mine - screw you." attitude shall not prevail.
Actually that is not my attitude. It is, "I worked hard for mine. If you are of sound mind and body you can do the same or do without".

[Dghs48]

It has been reported recently that the drop-out rate in the Indianapolis High Schools is 48%. Do you suppose that those who drop out will contribute to society to the same degree as those who earn qa Bachelors degree and maybe beyond? Yet in many cases they are the beneficiaries of many government (unearned) benefits. If it is the government plan to more nearly equalize income, should we not work towards more nearly equalizing contribution as well?

[Pragmaticone]

If it is the government plan to more nearly equalize income, should we not work towards more nearly equalizing contribution as well?

Horrors! What a cruel thought.